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Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/23/2009 10:00:57 PM
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Ephesians4_32
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What is the evidence of a worldwide flood?
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/23/2009 10:06:29 PM
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deermousie
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There's a lot of evidence; I'll only give you one: nearly every culture has a legend of a time when a massive flood destroyed nearly everything. It's practically universal.
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People died to give you the Bible in your language.
Read it. Eat it. Dwell in it. Rightly divide it. Live it.
Laugh, dance, praise your God, and go read some more. And God bless you.
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/23/2009 10:10:28 PM
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tendRmeRci
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I do not want to give you wrong information as to specifics. Next to the Gen. account of a world flood Please checkout www.answersingenisis.org. As a creationist myself we have all kinds of geological, physical and proof of a world flood not a local catastrophe as the media and some churches would have you believe
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tendR meRcy Ministries
Psalms 37:4-5
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/23/2009 10:19:43 PM
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Ezra
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Ephesians4_32
What is the evidence of a worldwide flood?
Genesis chapters 6-9.
For a detailed analysis read "The Genesis Flood" by Whitcomb & Morris (Baker Book House, 1961).
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And whosoever will, let him take the Water of Life freely. Revelation 22:17
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/24/2009 12:24:43 AM
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manhattan42
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Ephesians4_32
What is the evidence of a worldwide flood?
There isn't any scientific evidence of a worldwide 'flood' at any time in the earth's geologic history.
<shrugs>
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/24/2009 10:13:25 AM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Ephesians4_32
What is the evidence of a worldwide flood?
There seems to be quite a bit, just google it.
You might try HERE for a quick read.
Thanks
RC
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Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/24/2009 7:26:43 PM
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parkerbrother
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There is not a single bit of actual scientific evidence of a world wide flood as describe in Genesis.
There are mountains of geologic, archaeologic, and anthropologic evidence that no such flood occurred.
The entire body of world science inclining every prestigious scientific organisation in the world and every living Nobel prize winner in the sciences believe with certainly that no such flood occured.
< Message edited by parkerbrother -- 12/24/2009 9:11:46 PM >
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/24/2009 9:25:39 PM
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heremainsfaithful
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Hebrews 11:1 doesn't specifically refer to a flood, but it does define faith pretty well. I think my implication is pretty clear here.
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Eihstein's IQ may be higher than mine, but God's IQ is higher than anyone's.
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/25/2009 2:05:17 AM
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deermousie
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quote:
ORIGINAL: parkerbrother
There is not a single bit of actual scientific evidence of a world wide flood as describe in Genesis.
There are mountains of geologic, archaeologic, and anthropologic evidence that no such flood occurred.
The entire body of world science inclining every prestigious scientific organisation in the world and every living Nobel prize winner in the sciences believe with certainly that no such flood occured.
Wow - scientists now have proof that no proof exists! That means they know 100% of everything and there is no proof of a flood anywhere! I must have missed the news when they announced this.
Oh, wait... I'm a scientist (Bachelor of Arts, Biology, University of CA; CA teacher's credential in Biology, which means the state of CA thinks I'm knowledgeable enough and competent to teach biology) - and I've seen erudite discussions of the Noaic Flood with evidence that there was a world-wide flood. There are thousands of Christian scientists who are strong Creationists, but it's hard for them to be heard because their beliefs aren't politically correct.
I also know that anything that points to Creationism won't be published in secular, peer-reviewed scientific journals, because some don't believe it.
It's a belief problem, not a science problem. You're being lied to. There are divergent beliefs in the scientific world and you aren't being told about it.
The Uniformitarianists have held sway over what gets published in journals and textbooks since the 1960s (were you aware of that?). That may be changing now with climate investigation involving comets/asteroid events, but they are still death on Creationism of any kind, including a biblical flood.
The irony is that the Scientific Revolution was begun by Christian scientists, who figured a knowable God must have created a knowable world, so they set out to discover it. Nearly all the great scientists until the last century took Creation, not Evolution, for granted as being true, because they were believers. Christians.
Where are you getting your information? State school textbooks? Peer-reviewed journals? TV? You aren't being told the whole picture. If there is contraversy, how come they aren't telling you the other side? Scientists are supposed to look at the evidence... all of it... before making conclusions.
There are things being suppressed. Find out about it. It won't be easy.
_____________________________
People died to give you the Bible in your language.
Read it. Eat it. Dwell in it. Rightly divide it. Live it.
Laugh, dance, praise your God, and go read some more. And God bless you.
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/25/2009 11:44:48 AM
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19ramman85
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quote:
ORIGINAL: manhattan42
quote:
ORIGINAL: Ephesians4_32
What is the evidence of a worldwide flood?
There isn't any scientific evidence of a worldwide 'flood' at any time in the earth's geologic history.
<shrugs>
So, from East to West, and back again - how do you explain the basic tenants of all the stories of big-time floods, that pre-date even the existence of the Egyptian Empire by thousands of years?
-charles
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/26/2009 5:28:10 AM
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Ephesians4_32
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quote:
ORIGINAL: parkerbrother
The entire body of world science inclining every prestigious scientific organisation in the world and every living Nobel prize winner in the sciences believe with certainly that no such flood occured.
That means nothing to me. You are telling me what a group of people believe.
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/26/2009 5:30:07 AM
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Ephesians4_32
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 19ramman85
quote:
ORIGINAL: manhattan42
quote:
ORIGINAL: Ephesians4_32
What is the evidence of a worldwide flood?
There isn't any scientific evidence of a worldwide 'flood' at any time in the earth's geologic history.
<shrugs>
So, from East to West, and back again - how do you explain the basic tenants of all the stories of big-time floods, that pre-date even the existence of the Egyptian Empire by thousands of years?
-charles
If you lived in a primitive culture long before the time of Christ, you didn't even know how large the earth was.
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/26/2009 9:53:49 AM
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AdamsEve
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If I may add a thought...
When we built our home; while digging for the basement we found clam shells
at least four foot below the ground surface. We are about 700 feet above sea level.
While walking around at the lodge at the Grand Canyon I found a sea
shell embedded in sediment rock. I don't know the elevation of the lodge.
In my mind that is the world wide flood.
AdamsEve
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Give thanks to the LORD, for He is good; His love endures forever.
Word of God
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/26/2009 9:56:22 AM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: parkerbrother
There is not a single bit of actual scientific evidence of a world wide flood as describe in Genesis.
There are mountains of geologic, archaeologic, and anthropologic evidence that no such flood occurred.
The entire body of world science inclining every prestigious scientific organisation in the world and every living Nobel prize winner in the sciences believe with certainly that no such flood occured.
Isn't it amazing how many pinheaded overeducated "Experts" can be wrong on something.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/26/2009 11:36:29 AM
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drmark
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quote:
In my mind that is the world wide flood. Right on, AE! As Ken Ham of AiG puts it: "Billions of dead things (fossils) buried in rock layers laid down by water all over the Earth" is all the evidence needed to prove the worldwide Flood!
quote:
Isn't it amazing how many pinheaded overeducated "Experts" can be wrong on something. It's really not so amazing when we realize these "Experts" are merely exercising their religious faith in uniformitarian naturalism, which is the state-sponsored dogma of secular humanists. They cannot allow biblical facts of history to interfere with their self-centered worldview of godless materialism. What is truly amazing to me is that we Christians have allowed the secular humanists to dictate public education with nary a whimper... 
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/26/2009 12:48:49 PM
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manhattan42
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 19ramman85
quote:
ORIGINAL: manhattan42
quote:
ORIGINAL: Ephesians4_32
What is the evidence of a worldwide flood?
There isn't any scientific evidence of a worldwide 'flood' at any time in the earth's geologic history.
<shrugs>
So, from East to West, and back again - how do you explain the basic tenants of all the stories of big-time floods, that pre-date even the existence of the Egyptian Empire by thousands of years?
-charles
I don't explain such.
All cultures have some kind of 'creation' myths as well.
There simply is, however, no cohesive geologic evidence that there was ever a 'world-wide' flood.
Regional flood?
Quite likely, especially if it occured at the end of the last ice age about 10,000 years ago.
New evidence from the Black Sea showing cities submerged hundreds of feet below sea level supports the regional flood theory.
It is suspected that melt water from glaciers that was previously trapped broke through ice dams near the Bosphorus and flooded the Black Sea rasing it to its present level.
Such a catacysmic event could have easily been mistaken by ancients as having been 'worldwide'.
Similar evidence exists for major regionalized flooding events in and around Yellowstone region in the US.
Worldwide flood?
No.
Regional catastrophic flooding?
Quite likley.
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/26/2009 1:03:02 PM
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PolarBear
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For an alternative Christian view that takes the Bible seriously yet is compatible with scientific evidence:
http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/localflood.html
This makes more sense to me than the traditional Sunday School interpretation of the passage. I don't want to debate it again so I'll leave it at that. Read it, and take it or leave it.
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/28/2009 12:40:51 AM
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Ezra
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quote:
There simply is, however, no cohesive geologic evidence that there was ever a 'world-wide' flood.
Why should we assume that only geological evidence is convincing enough?
And why should we assume that all geological evidence has been interpreted correctly, and not with an original bias towards uniformitarianism?
And why should we assume that *evidence* does not include a sober, reliable and accurate record of what actually happened, which also happens to be Divine revelation?
The bias of those who reject a worldwide flood is quite clear. Since the only reliable written record of such a flood is in the Bible, and the Bible includes God and His workings on earth, this evidence cannot be included in assessing this matter.
In a court of law, the written testimony of an eye-witness would be treated as being of the utmost importance. Yet God's testimony to the Flood is simply rejected out of hand by the scoffers. This is not surprising in the least. See 2 Peter 3:3-9.
_____________________________
And whosoever will, let him take the Water of Life freely. Revelation 22:17
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/28/2009 5:24:19 PM
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freeholder
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Genesis tells us the world was all underwater AT CREATION. No lifeforms for fossils though, but all the marking of submersion could as easily have begun there. There was certainly a flood at Noah's time that wiped out the Middle East and left signs. It would have been sudden if it was related to the ice age and would have taken all living things not prepared for it.
The Bible deals with God's people and their survival and they would have been "the world" and "the people" all of which were destroyed by the flood, save for faithful Noah.
We all can agree that part is right, right?
So we can expand it beyond the Middle East or not, depending on our beliefs in geology or the sea shells under our houses, beliefs which may change over time and grow or shrink but none of which should alter our basic belief in the reality of God.
I say this only to point out that our arguments here get used for the basis of some interesting attacks by unbelievers in other forums. Maybe we should at least emphasize that the arguing is over present trivia rather than the reality of God.
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/29/2009 7:11:33 AM
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PolarBear
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Freeholder: exactly
Ezra: yes of course God's revealed word should well be taken as evidence of what happened. However a careful study of said Word does not necessarily result in a worldwide flood being the only (or even best) interpretation. I urge everyone to read the article in my previous link.
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Who Is This God: Can a ministry-driven film be developed collaboratively on Twitter? (Currently tweeting through Isaiah 40+)
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/29/2009 2:38:55 PM
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Ezra
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quote:
ORIGINAL: PolarBear
Freeholder: exactly
Ezra: yes of course God's revealed word should well be taken as evidence of what happened. However a careful study of said Word does not necessarily result in a worldwide flood being the only (or even best) interpretation. I urge everyone to read the article in my previous link.
Since the apostle Peter -- by Divine inspiration -- states in the above passage (2 Pet. 3) that *the world* underwent a Deluge, this does not need to be reinterpreted to accommodate scoffers.
The Genesis account clearly indicates this also. Because of extreme sin and evil all mankind came under judgment at the time of the Flood. This in itself is proof that there were no little (or big) pockets of habitation that escaped this judgment. Furthermore when Peter says that only "eight souls" were saved by the Ark, it is thereby implied that all other souls perished.
_____________________________
And whosoever will, let him take the Water of Life freely. Revelation 22:17
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/29/2009 3:04:02 PM
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Row1
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If 27,000 square miles of the United States were flooded, somewhere in the recent 100 years, would you know about it? Would there even be evidence in U.S. history textbooks? Would people have talked about it when New Orleans flooded?
Maybe, maybe not.
Here is a link to the Great Mississippi Flood of 1927. Look at the map. The Katrina flooding of New Orleans was a puddle compared to this.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:1927_LA_Flood_Map.jpg
This event was pretty big, yet hardly any of us, here in the U.S., know about it.
More area than each of these states: WV, MD, HI, MA, VT, NH, NJ, CT, DE, or RI.
Those of us who do know about it know because of some specific educational path that has brought us to the story, not because of some general knowledge.
Just to show you that a big event will not necessarily be accurately recorded or remembered, even within a short distance and time span. If someone brings up this great Flood, are you gonna deny it because you never heard of it? Because it is not in your high school text book?
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/30/2009 2:29:24 AM
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autocad
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Many Many Many years ago, I checked out 3 books on evolution, and 3 books on creation. I was curious, and I like to study both sides, of an issue.
The creation books, would quote Scientific American magazine, from past years.
Something like 'Coral has been found at 300' below sea level. Since coral needs sunlight to grow, at one time the sea was 300' less. It was very interesting that the Creation books, would use Scientific American, which is very evolution based.
Also, National Geographic had an article once, about a tribe (don't remember where) , and part of the history/folklore of this tribe was a story of a great flood.
So in my thinking, we may not find 100% proof of the flood, but lots of evidence.
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RE: Evidence for Worldwide Flood? - 12/30/2009 1:56:35 PM
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brian231
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Ezra
quote:
There simply is, however, no cohesive geologic evidence that there was ever a 'world-wide' flood.
Why should we assume that only geological evidence is convincing enough?
And why should we assume that all geological evidence has been interpreted correctly, and not with an original bias towards uniformitarianism?
And why should we assume that *evidence* does not include a sober, reliable and accurate record of what actually happened, which also happens to be Divine revelation?
The bias of those who reject a worldwide flood is quite clear. Since the only reliable written record of such a flood is in the Bible, and the Bible includes God and His workings on earth, this evidence cannot be included in assessing this matter.
In a court of law, the written testimony of an eye-witness would be treated as being of the utmost importance. Yet God's testimony to the Flood is simply rejected out of hand by the scoffers. This is not surprising in the least. See 2 Peter 3:3-9.
Incorrect and misleading. There are many other near eastern cultures with a flood story that predates even the Biblical account.
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